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For those awakening divine humans

The Fifth Wave (The New Feminism in the New Energy)

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Artwork by Maria Chambers

If you’re reading this and resonate with it, you are one of the few who came to this planet to discover who they are, and to change the direction of history. If you are a woman, you came here to become the new role model of the enlightened woman. You were brave enough to make this lifetime the lifetime of change for yourself.

Personally I am done looking for role models of an enlightened woman. Let’s be honest, isn’t it embarrassing how women are still perceived in the world. In this day and age, there are women in certain countries that are still severely oppressed. Add to that the ridiculous depiction of women in the media and in the entertainment world. I keep looking for role models but all I see are Supermodels. Major and minor roles alike in movies and television are showing women as more and more young, glamorous, thin and classically beautiful.  I’ve taken to watching more TV shows that originate from England because at least the women are cast as normal looking, and not as glossy magazine runway models.

We have been challenged as women to see our self-worth as either nurturers or emotional and physical caregivers.  In order to be taken seriously in the work world, we had to act like a man and embody that mental, competitive edge.  Our self-worth has been heavily defined by our body image, which generally can never meet up to the unhealthy standards set by our culture, at least here in the United States.

We’ve come in with a few handicaps. But we also knew that the new spiritual leaders are women.   It’s all changing now.

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Artwork by Maria Chambers

THE FIFTH WAVE

So we are in the process of releasing the caregiving roles, and subordinate roles along with our beliefs that we needed to appear physically a certain way in order to be loved and acknowledged. We are more and more setting our own standards for beauty and defining ourselves as beautiful beings who are falling in love with ourselves just as we are.

It begins with each of us claiming our sovereignty. The decision has been made already on a soul level, to integrate our Christ Consciousness. Along with that decision we have been facing emotional and physical discomfort, because our bodies especially are releasing a tremendous amount of old ancestral energies. We are learning not to take these personally. Yet, we are noticing in our personal lives that it is changing the dynamics between us and others, especially between us and men. We are seeing how we have been perhaps overly accommodating and allowed others to cross boundaries and feed from our energies. Our kindness was often seen as a weakness. However, we are also recognizing that we did this in order to feel safe. As women, needing to be needed was synonymous with being loved. But we paid a hefty price for that caregiving role. We ended up feeling angry and resentful, and for reasons of a historical nature, often did not allow ourselves to express those feelings. So they became buried in our bodies. Conditions such as colitis, cystitis, dermatitis, sinusitis, vaginitis, and other inflammatory illnesses are related to, quite often, the feminine condition of repressed emotions.

So as we embody our soul, as we embrace our Divine Selves, all of these patterns come to the surface to be released, to be set free.

It may take a while longer than expected because these are bodily conditions and the body takes time to catch up with our consciousness.

LETTING GO

There’s also another factor. There is a part of us that still wants to hang onto that role of needing to be needed. For without it we feel at least initially a little lost. Who am I, we ask, if I am not needed? It feels a little empty without someone in our life who seems to need us emotionally.  Even though that created a feeding off our energies.  Historically, we as women were seen as virtuous for taking on the emotional turmoil of others. Of feeling what they were not able or willing to feel for themselves.  Yet that type of ‘service’ created discomfort in our minds and bodies.  We had, over the course of many, many lifetimes, become so familiar with that discomfort, that we did not consciously question it.

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Artwork by Maria Chambers

But the good news is as we integrate our soul into our bodies and our lives, we naturally radiate more confidence. All the insecurities that we grew up with as women take a back seat. Perhaps I am speaking more to the older generation here, because I believe those who are younger now as women, have much more self-worth and independence. And I am speaking to those who are on the ascension path. Because I believe the young girls in school are given shockingly unhealthy images of beauty which they feel compelled to work toward.

So, we are here to change the course of history for women on the planet. Those in politics, and in the social services are doing their part, but the real change comes from you and I who are in the forefront of this unprecedented transformational process.

It takes a brave and capable soul to come in at this time and declare to themselves and to the world that they don’t give a crap what anybody thinks of them. They are their own best friend. They are creating a reality along with other like-minded souls, in which they are safe. And that reality is shaped by self-love. By a kind of self-love that has nothing to do with sacrifice, compromise, or agenda. In this reality that they are creating for themselves, they are safe to express themselves sensually. They no longer worry that they will be misunderstood because they are so open and filled with spirit. They no longer worry that they will be labeled as either selfish, crazy, or promiscuous.

They realize that they can express their sensuality and sexuality through their creativity. Through various art forms. And they can then share those with others, because those forms contain their blessings and the New Energy.  And thanks to the internet, those expressions can live on long after those women have left the Planet.

Their confidence is growing, from the inside, so if others seem to disapprove or resent them for this growing self-love, the new enlightened women are less apt to let that bother them.  They are embracing a balanced Divine masculine within themselves that sets boundaries and that puts into action their heartfelt soul desires.

There are some people in their life who they will be letting go. Those relationships in which the other is not interested in their own soul or in becoming self-loving.  They will not need to justify or try to comfort those they are releasing, because they realize it is not their job. In fact, the comfort is what created the co-dependency to begin with.

They will go through fears of letting go, of wondering how it will turn out.  Will they be all alone?  Are they giving up their security?  Will there be guilt to deal with?  Are they betraying their mothers and their grandmothers on down the ancestral line?  Who will they be?  But then they will realize that the can no longer go back to that world.  They are leaving that prison behind forever, and entering a world in which they are truly free.

copyright © 2015, Maria Chambers, All rights reserved. Please feel free to share this content with others, post on your blog, your Facebook page, etc, but maintain this article’s integrity by including the author and source website link: Maria Chambers at http://www.soulsoothinsounds.wordpress.com

Author: soulsoothinsounds

Our lives are like great paintings or great pieces of music. If we focus on all the technical 'imperfections' we will miss the true beauty of the work. We won't see, or rather, FEEL the essence and spirit of the masterpiece. I no longer identify myself as a writer, artist, or musician. Rather I express my divinity, and my humanity through the media of art, music and writing. I began this blog because I wanted to give voice to my experiences and insights, and I wrote for myself primarily. Six years later, I am still writing for myself, and I am discovering that my experiences are not personal but universal - galactic even. And now I am more sure than ever that I am a new consciousness teacher, as each of you are. The way we teach is by going through the very human experiences, and as we ascend and shed our old selves, with love, and as we embody spirit in this lifetime, which we are all doing, we become the standards for others of the new divine human.

91 thoughts on “The Fifth Wave (The New Feminism in the New Energy)

  1. Reblogged this on elizabethsadhu and commented:
    Oh yes oh yes……..I AM a Sovereign LoveBean!

  2. Darn it! I wrote a whole post and then it went away……ANYWAY, I completely resonate with this post. Would love to chat sometime…..

    Thank you dear sister goddess!!!!

  3. so grateful for your posts Maria. i love how you express a strong voice for new feminine energy that’s so different than “feminist” energy. you speak to me in a way that feminism never has. you express the personal journey to wholeness of divine feminine energy instead of the external battle against lower masculine if that makes sense? i love that so much. ❤ ❤ ❤

    as exhausting as i find the whole "media image" of women and beauty standards stuff, i tend to be able to tune it out it enough to not be held back by it. i think it's because there's always a new "ideal" that tears women down so i'm sorta just numb to it all lol. to me any sort of "female physical ideal" is all just about catering to lower masculine energy, and i can't bear navigating anything lower masculine energy at all anymore, no ma'am.

    "the caregiver role" though… ugh. that has always been the hardest energy for me to exist around. it's such an unhealthy, heavy, unbalanced energy, but in our society it's what's considered "good". 😦 good gracious, i just can't. living in a world where it's still so strongly pushed that a woman's "purpose" is to be a wife or a mother or the energetic weight carrier in relationships makes my soul cringe. i no longer have the energy in me to speak all the feelings i feel about the role of women in relationships, about marriage, motherhood, patriarchy, caregiving and all those layers of mess about… it all just makes my soul cringe, but i think underneath all those different roles is the idea that a woman's purpose is defined by "what she is to someone else". like…what she can do for a man, what men think about her, how she serves others, who's burdens she carries, and so on and so on being a "supporting character" in someone else's journey. i've known since i was a little girl that all that felt wrong and no matter how much this world tries to force that stuff on me, it just feels wrong to my soul… i just can't take any of in on. so comforted to find others who feel it in their soul that we're meant to set ourselves free from those roles.

    thank you always, your voice gives comfort to my heart Maria ❤ ❤ ❤

    • sweet pea
      Yes it DOES make sense, about the new energy feminism isn’t about trying to be more like a man, battling the lower male energies, outside us or even within us..it’s all about co-operation now between the balanced Divine Feminine and the balanced Divine Masculine. And we on the forefront are creating within ourselves that very balance.

      I like your reference to women being too often the “supporting character in someone else’s journey”. Well put. And, yeah, knowing from early on that it just didn’t feel right. I could never warm up to my dolls and my easy bake oven. I tended to identify more with the male characters on t.v. and movies. They seemed to be having more fun.

      So we came into this lifetime specifically as females so we could change that dynamic, but I wager we didn’t quite know what we were getting ourselves into. Once again, shoving aside the other angels, getting to the front of that line, diving in, and…. voila! here we are….in biology, ancestral downloads of all that crap to boot!

      Thanks for your perspective. I enjoy it and I know others relate too….💚💜💙

      • yes 🙂 luv luv luv…

        “…the new energy feminism isn’t about trying to be more like a man, battling the lower male energies, outside us or even within us..it’s all about co-operation now between the balanced Divine Feminine and the balanced Divine Masculine. And we on the forefront are creating within ourselves that very balance… ”

        that captures so much for me 🙂

        ❤ ❤ ❤ big hugs to you Maria, the ideas you share are so so appreciated 🙂

      • ” I could never warm up to my dolls and my easy bake oven. I tended to identify more with the male characters on t.v. and movies. They seemed to be having more fun.”

        Yeees!!!! Same here! I didn’t like dolls at all!. I cut their hair and ripped their heads off. I thought they were really boring. Always wanted a remote controlled little car. I thought they were really great, but never got one.
        I, too identified with male characters as well though. Just like you I thought they are having more fun, they are more adventurous and free than the female characters. That resonated much more with who I was/am.

        As for typical roles for women. I heard more than once, that if a woman doesn’t want to have children, she is deemed as selfish. That is more than ridiculous, because it reduces women to the role of a child bearing being. How come men never hear they are selfish if they don’t want to have kids? And whose business is it anyway what women (or men) do with their lives?

    • ” i’ve known since i was a little girl that all that felt wrong and no matter how much this world tries to force that stuff on me, it just feels wrong to my soul… ”

      So perfectly said. Same here! Even as a little kid I felt that this is wrong, this is not what I want and I rebelled each time someone tried to push me into any preconceived role how a girl or a woman should be. No thanks.
      I never felt the need to be needed ever. I could never comprehend why someone would think that this is a healthy or good way of being. Ok if someone helps and cares for other people from the heart and because this makes them happy; there is nothing wrong about that. There are people like that and this is great, because that behaviour doesn’t drain them. But these people know their limitations as well, that’s why they are able to maintain an inner balance and feel good about the way they are.
      But if people do it ,because society expects them, too, because they have been conditioned that way and not because it reflects their inner being, then they will be unhappy about it.
      “makes my soul cringe” is such a good expression though. I completely know what you mean by it.
      Much Love
      Kat

      • Kat,
        You said, “I never felt the need to be needed ever”. Kudos, sister!! You are a wonderful role model for the enlightened woman!! A healthy balance of the Masculine and Feminine. Women need to be UNAPOLOGETICALLY themselves!💕💕

      • hey Kat,

        yes! i feel so so strongly the same way about “need”. it’s always messed my head up how people equate “need” with “love”. it isn’t! “need” = “what you can do for me”. it comes from a place of lack and trying to force others to fill your empty spaces rather than loving them for who they are. to me pure love comes from wholeness, not lack. love is being and enjoying and sharing yourself, not taking and draining someone else. oh goodness i could write a book about it lol, but yup i totally feel so much the same way about it. there is a really amazing essay out there somewhere about how you cannot need and love someone at the same time because once you need them it becomes about what they do for you and no longer about what you feel for who they are, i so wish i could remember it! i think you would totally resonate with ❤

        and Kat what you say about not wanting kids and being called selfish… ugh. i wont say too much because how i feel is the kinda thing that tends to start all kinds of fuss, but for me, (other than people who adopt kids who already have no one to take care of them), every reason for wanting and having children is selfish. :\ i could write a book about that too lol, but i don't have the energy to push that big ol' rock uphill against society. 😦

        funny when i read y'alls comments about not liking the girly stuff because i was actually a suuuuper girly little girl… LOVED dolls, LOVED barbies, hello kitty, pink, disney princesses, anything and everything girly, i still am super girly lolz 🙂 i've always loved everything about being a "girl", but i never ever wanted anything to do with what it means to a "woman". even as a little girl i looked around and everything i saw our society pushing on women killed my spirit and i never wanted anything to do with being a wife or a mother. i grew up in a super abusive patriarchal environment, so all that "housewife, mother, catering to men" stuff was all kinds of everywhere, so for a long time i thought i felt the way i do as a reaction to my childhood, but now i understand it's not. i don't want to be a housewife or a mother simply because it's not who i am or want to be. i just want to be me and not be forced to be what other people need me to be. ❤

        it hurts my spirit that "womanhood" means becoming less of yourself. so so happy to know that there are other women drawn to this journey of becoming more of themselves. seeking to become fuller, brighter, whole beings, and not apologizing for it. ❤ ❤ ❤

    • Sweet pea everything you said here is so perfectly expressed i wish like heck id written it–but oh wow am i grateful to have read it (multiple times!). The clarity you gave to it is priceless. A woman being defined by what she is to someone else? SPOT ON. A supporting character in others’ stories? YES. Real love comes from wholeness not need? Yes, yes, YES!!
      And the best of all? “It hurts my spirit that womanhood means becoming less of yourself”. Oh my goodness that so perfectly summarizes how it feels. Just PERFECTLY. I grew up in the same abusive patriarchal controlling violent environment you describe, was also super girly, but jeez beeing a “woman” sure didnt have any draw–from the figures in my fathers pornographic magazines, to the image of my oppressed mother –just yuck. And never wanting kids–for more reasons than i can count (and also being told i was selfish–but i felt HAVING them was selfish!). So thankful that even though it took decades for me to realize it (& wow yes like Maria said i think young girls/women today are far more aware & confident), at least it’s finally clear to me that i do NOT have to conform to ANY of that nonsense any more or ever again. Theres some serious freedom right there. I love you ladies here for everything you articulate–it bolsters and strengthens me!! Thank you. Sweet pea i know this comment came late to the game but i sure hope you see it 💙💙💙

      • oh gosh Elila, we just have such similar feelings of things and have such similar things on our journeys, i get chill bumps whenever i read what you share.

        i understand this so much…

        “…but jeez beeing a “woman” sure didnt have any draw–from the figures in my fathers pornographic magazines, to the image of my oppressed mother –just yuck…”

        yup, sounds just like the limited options i was given in my good ol’ christian/southern baptist upbringin’ where every pastor had a mistress and my daddy always had a playboy on the end table right under his bible. there wasn’t anything that felt whole or free or truly happy and healthy about any kind of woman i was given the option to be… just different versions of things like powerless and taken for granted or disrespected and unworthy… all with the purpose of gaining approval and acceptance from men who don’t embody one bit of the kind of energy i ever want in my world anyways :\

        so yes ma’am…

        “…it’s finally clear to me that i do NOT have to conform to ANY of that nonsense any more or ever again… ”

        whenever i get discouraged about the ME i want to be but haven’t yet become, i remind myself that it’s taken a lot of courage to first say no to who i don’t want to be.

  4. Thank you Maria and yes I agree. We need to be ourselves.
    I never felt the need to be needed, still sometimes people tried to push me into that role.
    Much Love to you and the rest of the gang here ❤

  5. YES, I resonate fully…phew! I have had a complete turnaround with needing to save to now sitting with the peace I have inside. I am yet to venture away from my self created cocoon partly because I am still stunned with my transformation but mainly because I am burnt out with the work that this has needed.
    Thank you, Maria and much Love to you ❤ xxx

    • Leah
      Yes, good way to put it, “stunned with my transformation…” and that place of peace is the reward, and is also the key to the receiving of all that your heart desires, or whatever your soul wants to explore with you next. I dare say many of us are at that juncture, where we have moved through so much, let go of so much, and know that we will be moving into a radically new place, in these bodies, in this lifetime. But, some’time’ is required to adjust (mostly physically) and to integrate all we have done. Very exciting times ahead. 💛💙💚

  6. “Stunned with my transformation….burned out from the work that this has needed”

    Wow Leah yes–that is exactly how i feel too! I wish i could just sleep until my body catches up & its time to move into new spaces. Im exhausted mentally & physically & cant work up much interest in anything aside from meals LOL😜

    And Maria, Kat & sweet pea, as usual your comments elicit lots of “yep! Me too!”
    Love to you all 💕🌺💕

  7. Pingback: The Fifth Wave (The New Feminism in the New Energy) ~ Maria Chambers | Our Shifting Perspective

  8. Dear sweet pea,

    ” i’ve always loved everything about being a “girl”, but i never ever wanted anything to do with what it means to a “woman”. even as a little girl i looked around and everything i saw our society pushing on women killed my spirit and i never wanted anything to do with being a wife or a mother”

    I just thought about this article and your comment today and remembered how I didn’t want to grow up into a woman either. I mean literally. The first ever time I got my period I cried bitter tears and I kept it secret from my family and friends for years. I didn’t use pads but toilet paper just so my mother doesn’t find out I’m menstruating. For many years I thought it’s because my parents never treated the human body and all its functions with ease but everything that involved sexuality (and menstruating kind of does) was deemed as “dirty”. But now I realised it’s because I didn’t want to grow up into a woman and experience what a woman has to experience and in my eyes that wasn’t so pleasant. I didn’t like the way my mother was submissive to my father and put up with his extremely temperamental behaviour, beating his kids and being verbally abusive to her. I didn’t like that she never stood up for her children.
    I always knew I was different than her, but I still dreaded growing into a woman. Maybe because I knew it’s gonna be a fight, or maybe because I didn’t have a positive role model in the family? I don’t know. But yeah, I very much understand you.

    • Kat, gosh i so understand you too. my daddy was abusive in every way possible, and because he was “the man of the house” he ruled our entire world, and so exactly what you said, my mama not only submissively put up with it all, but allowed her kids to have to endure it all. i grew up believing that a woman’s purpose in life was to endure abuse, anger, manipulation, control, religious brainwashing, lying, cheating, constant energetic chaos, and basically just being a support system for a man’s selfish darkness. i too remember feeling pretty young that if that was the role of a woman in this world i just didn’t want any part of that journey.

      even now i struggle so much with what a woman is in our society, because even though my family was all kinds of dysfunctional and the abuse obviously isn’t considered good, i still cringe at how much that exact same underlying dynamic is pushed on women and even celebrated… that whole idea that this life is man’s journey, and a “good” woman’s purpose is to emotionally support a man and cater to his desires. it of course confuses me why so many women agree to that role, but i’m also so lost and confused why men want that :\ i mean when i think how i feel as a woman, i want the men in my world to be so beautifully whole… to be independent and happy and self-sufficient and fulfilled on their own, to be full of love for themselves and strong and free… i would honestly want a man i love to be the best version of himself according to his own dream of what that is – i don’t have any desire to have a man cater to my needs or support me or provide for me or carry my burdens(which a lot of people think is normal to expect), and i would for sure never ever want him to be some submissive character in my story that i get to control and manipulate and use and abuse and take out my darkness on 😦 if i love you, i want you to shine and be happy.

      i guess it just hurts my heart because i feel it so strong in my soul that women and men have the capability of becoming such beautiful, radiating, divine, magical beings who could experience love for themselves and each other in such amazing ways we’ve never seen before in this world, and when i look around, most everyone is fighting as hard as they can not to let go of theses old ways that don’t really make anyone truly happy :\ i think because of the emotional energy i took on from my parents, and because of this whole “soul at the forefront” path we seem to be on, i feel like i’ve sorta carried this universal weight of feeling like i have to shift this energy for “all women” and “all men” my whole life :\, so little by little i’m trying to learn that it’s not my job to do anything for “all women” and “all men”…my only “job” is to learn that love within myself.

      • OMG SO well put. Especially this one

        ” i grew up believing that a woman’s purpose in life was to endure abuse, anger, manipulation, control, religious brainwashing, lying, cheating, constant energetic chaos, and basically just being a support system for a man’s selfish darkness.”
        Especially that last half sentence..”being a support system for a man’s selfish darkness”. That is soo us in our family. Uncanny how similar our experiences are here.

        ” it of course confuses me why so many women agree to that role, but i’m also so lost and confused why men want that”

        I think they want to keep it that way (men) because they seemingly benefit from it, it’s convenient for them, but they don’t realise that it keeps them from living their full potential. Maybe that is why women are mostly on the forefront of ascension, because we have have beeen enduring that psychological strain for such a long time now and thus have more reason to break the cycle. People tend to want to change something when they suffer, men (of course I am generalising here) don’t suffer from patriarchy as much as women do and so don’t feel like they want to change anything.

        ” so little by little i’m trying to learn that it’s not my job to do anything for “all women” and “all men”…my only “job” is to learn that love within myself.”

        Damn right. I’m sick of “taking it for the team”. It’s about me and only me in the first place.

      • oh this articulates it perfectly for me!

        “…I think they want to keep it that way (men) because they seemingly benefit from it, it’s convenient for them, but they don’t realise that it keeps them from living their full potential…”

        like the ego convinces them they are satisfied with things like power and control, so it’s easy to ignore that the soul is unhappy. and that’s prolly why i can’t understand it :\, because i’m viewing it all from a place of what my own soul wants rather than what someone else’s human ego may be fed by.

        and i love this!

        “…Maybe that is why women are mostly on the forefront of ascension, because we have have beeen enduring that psychological strain for such a long time now and thus have more reason to break the cycle. People tend to want to change something when they suffer…”

        that gave me chill bumps ❤ because that makes perfect sense to me! i've seen it described so much as women being at the forefront with this idea that "it's now our turn to guide our men", and while i understand the idea that there is a shift into the feminine, every time i read that description of it all i also think… noooo 😦 if that's what's happening then nothin's really changing lol, women are still trying to "do the inner work for men". the whole purpose is that we can't grow for someone else's soul, and we each individually find our divinity through balancing the energies within ourselves. so yes, it makes much more sense for me that an individual soul just becomes so tired of suffering that it seeks something more than what it's ever known and settled for… and yes makes perfect sense that in the unbalance of a patriarchal world, more women would get to the place sooner.

        and i love this haha…

        "Damn right. I’m sick of “taking it for the team”. "

        yes ma'am same here 🙂 ❤ ❤ ❤

  9. Dear sweet pea,

    “like the ego convinces them they are satisfied with things like power and control, so it’s easy to ignore that the soul is unhappy. and that’s prolly why i can’t understand it:\, because i’m viewing it all from a place of what my own soul wants rather than what someone else’s human ego may be fed by”

    Yeah exactly. They don’t suffer in an obvious way. The world as it is now caters to them, so why would they want to change it? I was thinking yesterday if I would want to change something if I was in their position and I honestly don’t know. (Probably as I am very soul driven, but I’m sure it wouldn’t feel so urgent like it does now)

    ” women are still trying to “do the inner work for men”. the whole purpose is that we can’t grow for someone else’s soul, and we each individually find our divinity through balancing the energies within ourselves. so yes, it makes much more sense for me that an individual soul just becomes so tired of suffering that it seeks something more than what it’s ever known and settled for”

    Yeah that’s it. We are doing the work for us in the first place by balancing our inner feminine and masculine energies and whole humanity benefits from it. It is deconstructing patriarchy along the way when more and more people (women in the first place) become independent from it.. That Twin Flame experience we both had was a big accelerator in that whole process. I could feel the energies between me and him exhcanging and creating something new and I knew that clearing out and becoming balanced within was the purpose of that connection. But yeah during that time I definitely did some inner work for him, but I guess that was part of our soul agreement and that my clearing benefitted from it as well, because I was clearly much more stable than him. I don’t think that’s the default version of a TF relationship though (not all women bear more than the men; it can be the other way round).

    That whole thing we discuss here (abusive male behaviour) is a very current issue for me.
    I went to see my parents last month and while growing up I always had a difficult relationship with my father, that I have worked on continously in the past years and the last couple of visits at their place it was actually quite ok. We seemed to be able to get on without shouting at each other (him of course starting the whole argument). But this time he fell back into some old patterns, that I haven’t seen in him for a long time. Basically he used me as his emotional punching ball for something else that bothered him. He used to do that all the time, when he didn’t have the guts to confront the real causer of his frustratrations, so he took it out on his family (and especially on me). But this time I m done. I just can’t be bothered anymore. I’m 35 years of age and I m not gonna be talked to like some idiot. The new thing was that my mum actually was on my side. She always used to ignore my pain so she didn’t have to take sides or she even tried to convince me to apologize (for HIS disgusting behaviour, we are talking violent outbursts here) so everything calmed down again. But this time she was completeley on my side and told him off for acting so disgustingly and telling him that he will end up on his own if he goes on like that.
    I know that this won’t have any consequences on their relationship and his behaviour (she would have to divorce him for things to really change but that’s not gonna happen) so I’m still keeping away from them, but that change in my mum’s behaviour was really interesting to see. Might have sth. to do with surviving strokes and becoming more confident, or maybe even with ascension and breaking old pattern.

    • hey Kat,

      gosh i just so relate to the dynamic of your family so so much… so wearing on the spirit 😦 i’m sure it’s all kinds of triggering to be around them. maybe a little comfort that your mama has maybe had a bit of shift though. even if it was a small moment in a lifetime of her not doing it, prolly nice to have her for once validate you in one of those moments. and even if it won’t have any consequences on their relationship and his behaviour maybe there’s a shift happening where she’s taking more responsibility for her energy, and you’re going to be able to let go of some of that weight you’ve carried for her :\ i know for me my mama’s role of “putting up with it all” was just as damaging to me as my his abuse was, so even if you never see growth in him, seeing growth in her could be really healing. i tried pretty hard for a while to inspire my mama into loving herself, until i finally realized it’s her journey to take, and if you try to pull people into the light, you just get dragged back into the dark. i left home around graduation and haven’t spoken to my daddy since, but i stayed in touch with my mama for a few years, and with her still being married to him, still being in such denial about it all, and just like your mama used to do, she was still trying to get me to take responsibility for his darkness… i just couldn’t stay being that broken person she needed me to be anymore. i knew i had to let her go too or i could never become the person i want to be.

      and yup for sure the biggest thing my twin flame experience did was push me into seeking wholeness within myself. it’s like it put me at the strangest crossroads of feeling more insanely close to my own soul and the truth of who i am than i’d ever been, and never feeling more lost and far away from my soul and my truth than i’d ever been… all in the same experience. too beyond crazy and confusing to ever make any kind of sense of, by i just have had to keep seeking my way down the path towards my soul and my truth.

      • “..and you’re going to be able to let go of some of that weight you’ve carried for her”

        Yeah that would be nice. I think the fact that she somehow got stronger within herself (and she did in many ways, that was just one way her strength showed itself) allows me to withdraw from them. Energetically as well as by not calling them as much I used to (I haven’t lived with them since age 19, so I don’t see them too often anyway). I think I subconsciously always felt like I can’t leave my mum alone.

        The old cycle used to be as follows: don’t provoke his violent and aggressive behaviour, which was hard enough, because he could kick off on about anything; there was no way we could foresee or prevent that as he was and still is very moody and unpredictable. Then we didn’t have any place to hide as we lived in a 2 bedroom apartment (the 5 of us, parents and my 2 sisters) so if he wanted to vent his frustrations on us there was no way we could hide.

        We also couldn’t properly react the way we wanted because it would cause a massive fight as my mother always had trouble with high blood pressure, so that other concern we had was to try keep mum sane. (it wasn’t really great of her to tell us we’d have to protect her when he freaks out and thus put a big responsibility on us). We were indirectly made responsible for his actions which we had no damn control of. He didn’t give a shit about my mother’s health as he never reflected on his disgusting behaviour and it always was someone else’s fault. I still had to stand up for myself (that was an internal need I felt) no matter how he then reacted (and many times it was violent) but at the same time it made me feel guilty because I was scared that it would cause my mum pain and inflict damage on her health After my mum had her first stroke 14 years ago he actually blamed me for causing it, knowing full well that – if anyone – he would be the one to blame. How could you say something like that to your child in the first place.

        I did ask my mum many times why she never divorced him and she said she wouldn’t know how to get by financially. Well, maybe that was her feeling, like she wouldn’t be able to survive on her own, but it was quite a high price to pay. I would never allow my husband to act like that towards my children.

        So I still wanted an ok relationship with my father and it seemed to work, we could talk about politics and general stuff for hours (we always could, even when I was a kid)
        but that incident a couple of weeks ago just made me feel like all my effort for improving our relationship was for absolutely nothing. A line was crossed for good.
        I won’t totally cut them out of my life, as I don’t see them much anyway and we live hundreds of kilometres away from each other but I won’t be as available as I used to be anymore.

        Sorry for writing so much about this, but maybe it helps other people who had similar experiences

      • Kat, not too much at all, like you said it’s uncanny how similar things we’ve been through are. the “cycle” you describe is like word for word my daily experience growing up. the constant anxiety and chaos never ends. of course we couldn’t ever do anything to foresee or prevent it because they create things to rage about just so they can rage. it forces you to keep changing yourself over and over….which is exactly what they want… for you to be constantly adjusting who you are to suit their needs. and the thing they are upset and raging about never truly even matters, it’s just their need at all times to find any reason to constantly keep everyone around them in fear and feeling unsafe. it’s honestly why i intend to live alone for the rest of my life lol… the simple gift of peace i have now just being in my own space in my home without anyone else’s chaos is like sunshine and cupcakes all day everyday lolzzz.

        and yeah, exactly what i was thinking…

        “… I think the fact that she somehow got stronger within herself (and she did in many ways, that was just one way her strength showed itself) allows me to withdraw from them…”

        when spend your childhood energetically and emotionally parenting your family cause your parents were such a mess about, it can be quite a bit to untangle from :\

        just so much similar in our stories…my mama has high blood pressure too, and she was pretty much just always sick with something or another. and yup my daddy was a an insensitive jerk about it all too. with my mama i kinds always wondered if getting sick was a subconscious way of begging him to nurture her and give love :\ but i think it just made him see her as even more dependent on him.

        my daddy was just too dark for me to stay connected. one of the ways he was abusive was sexually, and everyone else was in denial about it, but i was gut wrenchingly suffering in my soul cause of it, so i eventually just couldn’t keep knowing the person that gave me that pain and ever hope to heal from it. :\

        i never asked my mama why she stays, because i knew she would never ever think to leave. she married him at 18, and she never even had a chance to become anything else in life but his wife, so she wouldn’t dare to think who she could be without him :\.

  10. “it forces you to keep changing yourself over and over….which is exactly what they want”

    my reaction to this constant feeling of insecurity and uncertainty was becoming independent at a very young age. In the sense that I realised that I couldn’t do anything to “earn” love (as it was so unpredictable), so I decided to not seek it outside of myself. It made me more or less immune to peer pressure or needing approval of others. Even my parents. That is one good thing that came out of it.

    ” one of the ways he was abusive was sexually, and everyone else was in denial about it, but i was gut wrenchingly suffering in my soul cause of it, so i eventually just couldn’t keep knowing the person that gave me that pain and ever hope to heal from it.:\”

    I am so so sorry to hear that sweet pea. I completely understand that you had to cut all ties. That is something absolutely unforgiveable (in my eyes). May I ask if you ever seeked counselling for this ? or have you told anyone else about that experience?
    You have come a long way since those days and you are very strong. It can only get better.
    All the best for you

    • hey Kat,

      that strength comes through so much in what you write here 🙂 ❤ i like the bit of sass in your energy too haha :0)

      i feel the same way in that i see the beautiful qualities i carry in me after having been through these kinds of things. and not sure if this will make sense…i don't really feel it so much as my childhood experiences giving me those qualities, more like my soul chose a family where i would experience the kinds of things that would help reveal them. like my independent spirit, and all the special ways i feel about relationships and love, and that passionate desire in me to seek wholeness, that could all seem reactionary to my childhood, but instead they feel like truths that my soul already carried inside of me as i came into this world, and those childhood experiences were what i was meant to go through to trigger me to look inside and seek them. 🙂 ❤

      and yes i did go to counseling right after high school, and i was also in a support group for a bit with some other young women who'd been through the same thing. the counselor was really important in just giving me a safe place to speak out loud what happened and she was also big trigger in my ascension process cause she gave me some of my first lil' glimpses of spirituality outside of my religious upbringing. the support group was quite a bit of comfort, but after about 8 months in the group i reached a point where i felt like i was getting stuck in my victim story and i knew i was ready to let go of the need to talk about it all the time and analyze and relive it. it helped to bring it all to the surface and get it out of me, but i didn't want to stay stuck in my victim story as my identity, so i just was ready to go forward. i really only ever speak of it now in conversations like these, and it's really not any different to speak of than then the other things he did. now the whole experience has sorta just become one of the human challenges on my soul's journey here, and it really doesn't feel personal to me anymore, it sorta just feels like another wound against the feminine that so many of us are here healing. i had to disconnect from my parents to get to this place about it, but i do feel a sense of it not being about me and it not being part of who i am.

      thank you for sharing all that Kat, i do hope you're in the midst of a shift of getting to let go of the weight of it all and being more free to just be you ❤ ❤ ❤

      • “i feel the same way in that i see the beautiful qualities i carry in me after having been through these kinds of things. and not sure if this will make sense…i don’t really feel it so much as my childhood experiences giving me those qualities, more like my soul chose a family where i would experience the kinds of things that would help reveal them. like my independent spirit, and all the special ways i feel about relationships and love, and that passionate desire in me to seek wholeness, that could all seem reactionary to my childhood, but instead they feel like truths that my soul already carried inside of me as i came into this world, and those childhood experiences were what i was meant to go through to trigger me to look inside and seek them.2

        Yes that makes absolutely perfect sense to me as I’m sure all those qualities I have (that rebel and pioneer spirit, my strength, and so on) is inherent to my spirit and I chose these experiences in order to live these qualities. I perfectly know what you mean. I thought about the same thing today while cleaning my flat funnily enough (before I read your response) 😀 I thought that the difference between people shows the most in their reaction to the same experiences. Many people have similar experiences, but not all come to the same conclusion and take the same conseqences. The fact that I acted the way I did has something to do with my core, my spirit.

        I perfectly understand why you stopped going to those talking groups. I can imagine that it starts feeling like you are reliving that whole thing over and over again and that remain stuck in that victim role.

        ” i do hope you’re in the midst of a shift of getting to let go of the weight of it all and being more free to just be you”

        Actually I do feel that this is what’s going on now for me. I just said to my sister today, that I have thought for a long time, that my childhood traumas are overcome (and they are in a way because I don’t get emotional over them anymore and that is one big sign that I have dealt with them), but I never thought that I would have to get distant to my parents due to my father’s behaviour and the fact that he hasnt learned anything at all ; that experiece a few weeks ago definitely triggered something in me and just made me realise i need to keep distance in order to let go and untangle from them. I wasn’t aware that I was still entangled if you know what I mean. But I see it as just another stepping stone on my way to freedom and peace. It can only get better 🙂

        All the best sweet pea. I am excited to see where we will be going and how pure freedom will feel like 🙂

      • hey Kat,

        “… inherent to my spirit and I chose these experiences in order to live these qualities….”

        exactly ❤

        "…But I see it as just another stepping stone on my way to freedom and peace…"

        and yay, i love the idea that that's what's happening for you ❤ when it gets harder to be around something that makes us feel unloved, it's a sign that we're just learning to love ourselves more ❤ ❤ ❤

  11. hey Kat & Elila,

    not sure if either of y’all will see this, but i thought you’d both appreciate it. ❤

    Jennifer Aniston wrote an essay that came out and she perfectly spoke of some things we've all share here.

    here's the part of it all that makes my heart happy:

    "…I used to tell myself that tabloids were like comic books, not to be taken seriously, just a soap opera for people to follow when they need a distraction. But I really can’t tell myself that anymore because the reality is the stalking and objectification I’ve experienced first-hand, going on decades now, reflects the warped way we calculate a woman’s worth.

    This past month in particular has illuminated for me how much we define a woman’s value based on her marital and maternal status. The sheer amount of resources being spent right now by press trying to simply uncover whether or not I am pregnant (for the bajillionth time… but who’s counting) points to the perpetuation of this notion that women are somehow incomplete, unsuccessful, or unhappy if they’re not married with children. In this last boring news cycle about my personal life there have been mass shootings, wildfires, major decisions by the Supreme Court, an upcoming election, and any number of more newsworthy issues that “journalists” could dedicate their resources towards.

    Here’s where I come out on this topic: we are complete with or without a mate, with or without a child. We get to decide for ourselves what is beautiful when it comes to our bodies. That decision is ours and ours alone. Let’s make that decision for ourselves and for the young women in this world who look to us as examples. Let’s make that decision consciously, outside of the tabloid noise. We don’t need to be married or mothers to be complete. We get to determine our own “happily ever after” for ourselves…"

    here's the whole thing…

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/for-the-record_us_57855586e4b03fc3ee4e626f?0830ynt7rezmpldi

    anywayyyssss. she doesn't say anything we haven't felt ten ways to tuesday our whole lives, but just the idea of a woman in the mainstream collective saying so loud and clear these kinds of things we've felt in the shadows for so long… i dunno i guess it kinda made me feel this sense of relief that these burdens we've carried the energy of at the forefront of it all, we really don't have to carry that weight alone anymore, and the light we hold inside is spreading out into the world ❤ ❤ ❤

    • Sweet pea, I just read your last comment now and I love what J. Aniston said. About time a celeb was telling it like it is 😉
      And I sooo enjoyed rereading our old conversation above. So full of good points and wisdom 😆😆!!
      Love
      kat

  12. Oh.
    My.
    Gosh.
    Ladies i just re-read our above conversation and holy CRAP!!! Somehow i missed the last portion of it with kat and sweet pea and im just utterly shocked –the way u both describe childhood and your parents was the SAME for me–right down to mothers high blood pressure! And all the abuse and emotions and distancing–i finally broke all ties with my father (who was also sexually….innappropriate….i use that word because he was careful not to cross certain lines, and even now in adulthood no one believes me except one other relative who he was same with and she confirmed my suspicion and qualified it with “if you tell anyone i will deny it”. So.), until he became terminally ill and i joined with my sister to take care of him–something i did for HER –not him. I couldnt let her bear the burden of him alone (parents were divorced–not because mother left, she would NEVER have left him and declares her undying love for him to this day–he left her for one of his mistresses.) Few people understand when i say that his death was one of the best things thats ever happened to me, or how much it freed me. He was a selfish miserable abusive violent angry being and ive never once missed him in the last 15 years. The dynamic you two speak of–well id just be repeating all you said! This is amazing to be seeing this now. I feel the same about how my mother never protected me etc. And all the traits it brought out in me….this is all just so interesting how we all went through this! After fathers death i also distanced from mother and a relationship was manageable mostly from 1200 miles away. But now she is in ill health and requires looking after and now im living in her house –and holy crap it’s not nearly as easy as it was from several states away 😜. But just like before, its bringing buried parts of me to the surface and strengthening me in ways i never knew i could manage. The practice i get dealing with her–i can feel it shaping me into a much more confident and whole person–standing up for myself in ways i never could as a child, not letting her disrespect me or use me as her emotional dumping ground etc. All things that feel good to finally do, as stressfull as it can get sometimes with such a volatile being.
    I wish id written all this back in june, but i just wanted to tell you gals once again… ME TOO. Sooooo much love im sending
    💜💕💜💕💜

  13. Oh and kat–i was thinkin the very same thing–that this conversation was SO full of wisdom and intelligence and warmth

  14. Kat & Elila 💜💜💜

    awwww feels of no coincidence for me that you stumbled back here right now. this past year i’ve reallllly taken on so personal the backlash against the feminine that’s been raging in the collective, and i really took it on heavy the past 6 months, but this past week the universe has been helping me feel support in big ways about it all. so it’s kinda perfect Kat that you came back here 💜.

    i luv when i read back what we all share here, there’s that common energy in our stories how we all already knew all these sorta things we share here, even when we were little girls. maybe we couldn’t articulate it, but we all always knew we wanted and deserved better for ourselves, even when we didn’t know we knew 💜

    • “even when we were little girls. maybe we couldn’t articulate it, but we all always knew we wanted and deserved better for ourselves, even when we didn’t know we knew 💜”

      sweet pea: Soooo right. I think we’ve been born with that knowledge. With some higher sense of self worth than our mothers.
      This aticle popped up when I opened Maria’s blog on my phone. When I do that it’s not the latest article that comes first in line but some random one from the past. And I’m happy it did.

      @Elila:

      It’s astonishing to see how our mothers stood by our fathers after all they’ve done, isn’t it. My dad never cheated or anything, but he was as you described further “selfish, miserable, abusive ,violen,t angry”. Especially miserable, although he was SO much to grateful for and very unpredictable. When something happens it is always someone else’s fault. He has absolutely no sense for self reflection. I wonder if he is a very young soul who isn’t aware of himself that much. He could be flip out of the blue for nothing while the day before he was perfectly ok with that same behaviour of mine. It felt like walking on eggshells and being under pressure the whole time. No wonder I fled home at 19 and I don’t really enjoy coming back to visit; in fact I wouldn’t come if there wasn’t my mum who I adore.
      Elila I also answered to you under one of your comments on the article from Jan 13 “Human Needs And Desires”.
      Much love to both of you
      Kat

      • *although he has soo much to be grateful for.
        *he could flip out
        excuse the mistakes

      • Yep Kat i went over and read it and responded to you there. Thanks for the heads up– i might not have seen it otherwise!
        I too feel like ive spent my life on eggshells around these volatile (&alcoholic) people. Its truly exhausting. And YES–it is ALWAYS someone elses fault–they have NO capacity for self reflection and never utter any apologies. And yes too they both had so much to be grateful for!
        Also like sweet pea said ive become so utterly tired of repeating the story. I cant believe i managed to write some of it here (i had to–the similarities were just too uncanny not to add it)–it really just sickens me to repeat it again though, even briefly. And i agree that we knew we wanted and deserved better than our mothers lives, even though we didnt know we knew. There were certainly not any desireable alternatives around being modeled for me as a child, and really like Maria was saying there still arent! The way women are treated and portrayed on this planet is really gross and disheartening to say the least. Im tired of trying to find a role model too. I guess we are just going to have to do THAT ourselves too and BE the role models!
        Love back to you 💙

  15. sweet pea, there’s another thing I wanted to say. Do you remember how we used to talk about how we miss that feeling of yearning when we were kids. That we used to look into the sky and have this sweet feeling of yearning for something intangible.
    I thought the other day, that the biggest difference between back then and now is the underlying feeling I have for life/existence itself. Back in childhood there was a sense of expansiveness that went along or was part of that yearning. I was everything I saw and beyond. Now the sentiments are directed more inwards, it’s like the opposite of being expansive. Like my energies are focussed more inwards. Strictly speaking it does kinda feel limiting compared to then, but it is far from uncomfortable. I’d say I feel cozy within myself. Can you (or Elila) relate?

    • Yes kat i can totally relate. So often now when im experiencing difficulty or discomfort i catch myself wishing somone or something would be different, and i realize i need to turn inward for solutions and answers. That everything is inside me and not “out there” anywhere or in anyone else. So i spent whole life looking outside myself and now the challenge/adventure is goignwithin instead. Talk about “lookin for love in all the wrong places” LOL. So yeah its such a different angle and feeling to searching inside instead of out–bit perhaps the vista within ourselves is far more grand and expansive (and magical!) than we can perceive just yet?
      xx💜💜

      • “o yeah its such a different angle and feeling to searching inside instead of out–bit perhaps the vista within ourselves is far more grand and expansive (and magical!) than we can perceive just yet?”

        Hi Elila,

        good point and I think it’s true. I feel the expansiveness is coming back but this time we will also be secure and rooted within ourselves (as opposed to when we were children, back then we were too reliant on the adults around us) so we’ll have both. 😀 I feel that feeling of expansiveness as kids was beautiful but also so fragile because our lives were so dependent on our parents who had the power to hurt us and destroy that nice feeling instantly. It’s a different story now though

        And what you said above about role models. I never had one and I never took anyone as a role model. In fact I never understood why other people needed them. I definitely have had feelings of insecurity (still have) but I was always original if that makes sense and I never felt like I need someone to model myself on. Even as a young kid I felt that I have to go my path and that that path will be different from the others’ path. That also made me quite immune to peer pressure which is good.

        And ditto on what you said about feeling sick and tired about talking about the family history. Been there, done that, init. But I feel our conversation here has added value , because we are not whinging about it and crying on each other’s shoulder but analyzing it from a fairly neutral point of view, which we are only able to do because we are over it. And like you said, the similarities are so uncanny, we probably all feel compelled to comment 😀

      • Yes Kat “role model” isnt always the most accurate way to put it–i think maybe i would rather say there were no other examples of another way to be a woman here on planet earth? I think that even though im not prone to modeling myself after another that as a girl it would have been extraordinarily helpful to see different examples of women around me, women who didnt match the status quo, stronger women who didnt fully submit to misogynistic men, etc, just so i could have known it was POSSIBLE if that makes sense? All i saw around me was submission and opression.
        And about the expansiveness as a child–i really didnt get to experience much of that–like you said the parents were very thorough in killing anything like that, but oh yes it is a different story now, so im looking forward to more of that glorious feeling that ive never gotten enough of thus far! 😊

      • Oh and yes i do also agree that this conversation here has so much value–bcuz it is on a different level from all the victim feelings of the past (& yes the whining and wailing!) lol.

    • Oh and yes yes yes the cozy and cocooned within myself feeling!!!

      • “Oh and yes yes yes the cozy and cocooned within myself feeling!!!””

        haha yeah I love it! Not exactly exciting but nice and cozy. 🙂 ❤

  16. Hey dear Kat, Elila and Sweet Pea…. I’m so happy to see the rekindle of conversation here! I decided to re-post THE FIFTH WAVE because it felt relevant considering what’s going on right now here in the states, with the resurgence of feminism. But it seems there was another reason….as you say, it’s so amazing to re-read the comments, they are so filled with compassion and wisdom!

    I also want to say that its awesome to see women like yourself that no longer allow abuse in any for into their life.

  17. oh! i came through the comment notice so i didn’t even see it till now lolz :o) yes Maria so so relevant. that energy in the collective has honestly been sooo comforting for me. not everyone expresses it the same way i feel it in me, but i love that there are so many rising up in their own way they feel called to rise. makes me feel like we’re not nearly as alone in this as it feels so much of the time 💜

    and yeah Kat i feel a bit of the same way. and i do sense strongly it’s how i’m meant to feel right now, but i can’t say i really like it tho? 😕 i miss the magic 😦 but yup i think it’s kinda the same as my feeling with the “routines” in that it’s grounding and keeps me in a place of peace for now.

    • yeah, sweet pea, it is amazing how sometimes people need a kind of extreme ‘mirror’ as in a political leader, to see what has not been addressed within themselves. Women especially have been too complacent in allowing abusive and dismissive energies into their personal lives, from others, and even from their own self-judegment, which is the worse self-abuse, as we know. But we on the forefront of this enlightenment are the ones who are the most intimate with how our freedom is based on a type of self-love that the majority of people don’t yet understand. But they are getting there, and they will find their way to us because they will see that the solution is not ‘out there.’ Interesting times.💚

      • yes Maria, this is perfectly it…

        “…Women especially have been too complacent in allowing abusive and dismissive energies into their personal lives, from others, and even from their own self-judegment, which is the worse self-abuse…”

        there are still so many women that associate the idea of “a good woman” with things that are so incredibly misogynistic and self-hating, or at the very least self-limiting. i tend to be overwhelmed by how so many women fiercely defend that internalized misogyny. it wouldn’t be as much to bother about if it stayed internalized, but i’ve been way too tuned into how so many women who feel that way lash out against those of us women who are learning to love ourselves and rise above it 😦 . when i read through the stuff we shared here, i can see how my sensitivity to that energy relates to the role my mama played in my childhood.

        my whole life i’ve always felt like i had to “rebel” against the entire world just to embrace the energy that feels right and good to me, and my religious upbringing has always always added such heavy shame to embracing that energy 😕. so this rising energy of support for divine feminine energy feels like such air to breathe for me. like that energy i’ve always had to “rebel” to embrace, is being honored and supported by so many others. 💜💜💜

      • You really nail it…the way you describe your personal experience, especially as it related to your early environment. Me too, I always felt like I had to rebel against a very controlling father, without the support from my mom. And of course she was just lost in the wife role that so many women were back in the 50’s,60’s and 70’s (did most of my rebelling in the 70’s when I went off to college) I took up with and lived with my college art professor after college, who was 24 years my senior, and my dad went nuts. But of course, the professor was a womanizer and quite emotionally abusive. So, it’s interesting how we have been playing out these roles as men and women. And it seems religion has reinforced the ‘immoral’ behavior, especially for women. We were either virgins or whores.

        But you are right. Most women are not free. They are stuck, and they do not know how to get out of it. And yes, many do not want to see other women truly free because it makes them feel even more stuck.

        But it is a brand new day. And I know I have said it many times, but I believe we here on the forefront of this consciousness shift are here partly to free ourselves from the prison, from the inside out. Setting a new standard for women on the planet. And it sets free our mothers, their mothers on down the line!! And it’s the relatively quiet work we do compared to what others may be doing that effect the greatest change. Truly.

      • and Maria i’m guessing your father never saw the connection of the kinda man you gravitated to as being a reflection of the kind of man you grew up watching either huh 🙄 i mostly internalized my daddy and mommy issues and just tortured myself from the inside out… i almost think it woulda been less painful if i’d actually done more to act them out lol.

        but that’s one of things about this journey that i feel so grateful for…that the more free we become, we’re learning to make less and less of our choices out of reaction to our pain, and more and more because we’re guided by our light. 💜

      • No, sweet pea, I don’t think he did make the connection, at least not consciously. My dad’s manipulation tool was using guilt, trying to make me feel guilty if I didn’t comply with his decisions. I knew he was trying to protect me in a way, from what he knew men were capable of. But my response to his wielding guilt was anger. And it was hard to let go of that anger, and even the guilt, for a long time. But this awakening definitely pushed me to release all of that. I like how you phrase it:

        “but that’s one of things about this journey that i feel so grateful for…that the more free we become, we’re learning to make less and less of our choices out of reaction to our pain, and more and more because we’re guided by our light.”

  18. Lol sweet pea and maria–my father never saw that connection either netween the man i grew up with and the men i attracted (hell *i* didnt see it for a very long time!)
    Sweet pea i too agree w maria about what you said about being guided by our light instead of reacting to pur pain–that was really brilliantly stated 💙💙💙

  19. “as a girl it would have been extraordinarily helpful to see different examples of women around me, women who didnt match the status quo, stronger women who didnt fully submit to misogynistic men, etc, just so i could have known it was POSSIBLE if that makes sense? All i saw around me was submission and opression.”

    Yeah I do get you. I think for me it was just so clear that I’m not gonna succumb to the expectations society had on my gender, so that’s why I didn’t really care what other women did. I noticed my mum’s behaviour but I distanced myself from it in the sense that it was obvious that that is not gonna be how I want to live in the future. I never saw myself as a representative of the female sex anyway, but as a human. Dunno how else to put it, it’s hard to explain.

    But I grew up in the 80’s and 90’s and things back then were already a bit more liberal and open than before and I must say that my parents, especially my father, were inconsistent in how they raised us. I remember him being proud of my wildness (sometimes). He’s told me how one day he passed by my elementary school and there was me beating up 2 boys hahaha.
    He didn’t intervene, but just looked at it from afar, and I sensed his pride while he told me.

    Another time, he saw me having a fight with my friend and he came down and beat me up. That’s what I meant, you never knew what to expect. Even in his style of parenting (traditional/non traditional) he was inconsistent. I reckon that is why I didn’t see any other choice than to distance myself from all societal/gender expectations but then again I believe I was born like that and like I said to sweet pea above, the circumstances brought these qualities out.

    “but oh yes it is a different story now, so im looking forward to more of that glorious feeling that ive never gotten enough of thus far! 😊”

    And you’ll definitely get more of it and become more stable in maintaining it. Finally the Ascnsion process is paying off emotionally. Was about time, lol 😀

  20. hey Kat & Elila, it really does depend on your surroundings, because this would’ve been life changing for me too…

    “as a girl it would have been extraordinarily helpful to see different examples of women around me, women who didnt match the status quo, stronger women who didnt fully submit to misogynistic men, etc, just so i could have known it was POSSIBLE if that makes sense? All i saw around me was submission and opression.”

    i grew up in the 90’s, but i also grew up mostly in the south where a large portion of the entire culture is a good decade or 2 behind, and to this day a place where a lot of sexist values are still considered “normal” and are heavily pushed. and then i also grew up in a christian fundamentalist/southern baptist family where the core of our family structure was patriarchal oppression. my entire perception of life was formed out of my daddy’s idea of the reality he wanted to impose, and then i was taken to churches that basically brainwash you over and over with the same kinda beliefs. and there really wasn’t much in my world to offer a different way to be, because most of the other women i was around growing up(aunts, grammas, family friends, etc.) pretty much fell in line with those submissive and suppressed female roles.

    even though i felt it in my heart growing up that i wanted something different, i can honestly say i truly didn’t know women were even “allowed” to be different until after i left home and was out on my own. i’ve spent the years since leaving digging myself out of that brainwashed reality i grew up in, and even though now i know women are “allowed” to be different, i’m still shedding layers and layers of guilt about it. there is still a lot of those old beliefs in the back of my head that it’s “rebellion” or “bad” to step out of those roles :\

    but when i look back at all of that, it makes me feel like the energy in my soul to seek a different way to be as a woman has to be really really strong and powerful to have stayed alive and hoping and seeking through so many barriers that tried to suffocate it and keep it from believing.

    • Yeah it definitely does depends where you grow up. I completely agree. My family are from the Balkans. I don’t know if you are familiar with the mentality there, but they also follow rather traditional gender norms. And yeah, rebellion was basically the default behaviour of my childhood and youth hahaha. I’m laughing now, but it was stressful.
      I can imagine that it was really really hard in the South as well. Especially if a very conversative religious belief comes into play. My parents are Catholics and we had to go to Church every sunday as well, and I definitely gained my feelings of guilt regarding sexuality from my parent’s stiff and prudish attitude towards sexuality. As far as they were concerned, there was no sex. lol

      • Kat lol, i think the Catholic way of just pretending there is no sex is still healthier than the conservative Christian way, which is mostly a big mess of shaming women for everything and anything about about sex, while doing everything possible to cater to men’s desires, and also doing everything possible to excuse their men for being totally dysfunctional perverts 🙄 .

        grrrr yes and the idea that we have to “rebel” is perfectly the part of it all i’m that i’m sorting through layers of lately. now that i’ve made choices to live my life outside of traditional gender norms, i still have it in the back of my head that it’s considered “rebellion” to be this way, that i should feel guilty or feel as if i’m doing something wrong by choosing to be a way that just feels naturally for me to be. why is it “rebellion” that i don’t wish to get married or have kids? i just don’t want to lol. it’s not rebellion against anything at all :\ , it’s actually perfectly in line with how i naturally feel i’m meant to be. why is it “rebellion” that i’m independent – and always want to stay that way? being an independent being just makes sense and feels right to me.

        it’s funny cause as much as i am free in sense about it, i still need to let go of other people’s judgments and limitations about it to truly be free.

    • Kat and sweet pea,
      Wow yes it is amazing the strength our souls must possess to have gotten us this far and thru all that awful muck! I grew up in the 70’s so yeah it was a different feeling landscape, more akin to what sweet pea describes in the south, and heavily catholic. I feel like i was in kind of in a cloud of despair i couldnt identify or articulate as a girl–but i think it was some sort of deep anxiety or resignation that what i saw around me was all there was and that was how i was going to end up, despite it feeling soooo off and just wrong somewhere in me. The women all considered a husband, no matter how wretched, the highest badge of honor and achievement & the only source of self worth. I didnt see a single woman who elected to be single or not have children. I didnt even know what “gay” was–the parents were so prejudiced and racist that they made sure we always lived in all white neighborhoods with people who voted and thought just like them (& drank a lot). Talk about suffocating. And sheltered. And depressed! Kat i envy your strength and focus as a young person, your already solid sense of self. I think many more females are being born that way now and im thrilled to see it. None of my friends or anyone around me had that when i was younger. We all kinda toed the line for the most part. Sweet pea it was just like you described–reality was imposed and strictly enforced (psychologically and physically, with violence) by the father and his ideas of how he wanted things and no one (even the boys really) were “allowed” to be different. Different was unacceptable and death in a way. So im a bit late to the rebellion party, but crikey thank heavens, better late than never!!! I really love reading about the experiences and feelings of you younger gals, and seeing how some things have changed since i was a little girl, and seeing over and over females being born with much stronger sense of themselves and way less tolerance for the status quo. Part of me is shocked that the kind of atmosphere i grew up in still exists at all, but it is heartening to see evidence of it being eroded and less tolerated, especially by women–bcuz as long as women tolerate and accept and even defend misogynistic attitudes and behavior, and engage in all kinds of self hatred and inner beatings, the men will never change or adapt. So a lot of it is up to us not putting up with being reduced or dismissed or abused, like maria was saying. And it starts with us not beating OURSELVES up and practicing SELF LOVE until we are so good at it the world MUST reflect it back to
      us 😊💕💜💕
      Its entirely an inside job!

      • I love reading the discussion here among you all. I’m getting to know you all more. It’s interesting how we cover all the generations age wise. Being brought up in the 50s and 60s, and having a Greek father and italian mom, the gender expectations were very clear between me and my brother.

        You know, girls can’t help dad with anything involving a hammer and nails. And as we grew up, if i wasn’tt a ‘good’ girl i was a whore! I remember one night when i was probably eleven years old i prayed to wake up in the morning as a boy. I was so disappointed in the morning when it didnt happen!

        Little did i know its because women are the new spiritual leaders.

      • “The women all considered a husband, no matter how wretched, the highest badge of honor and achievement & the only source of self worth. ”

        Ridiculous isn’t it. And then they were slaves to these men and if they were lucky he didn’t cheat or beat her. There were good men, of course, but you get my drift.
        Like I said in my reply to sweet pea above, I have people like that among my relatives who still think like that. One of them my cousin who is younger than me.

        My mum even said the other day “you won’t be able to keep him” when I said I couldn’t be bothered to cook sth. for my boyfriend. I just laughed. I don’t take these things seriously. My mum is just from a different planet than I in this respect and I accept that.
        I told my mum to her face that I’d rather be alone all my life than be with someone like my father. That was when I still lived at home and I criticised her for putting up with his shitty behaviour and she replied “let’s see how your husband’s gonna be”.
        That’s quite a shitty thing to say actually but it speaks volumes about her views.

        “bcuz as long as women tolerate and accept and even defend misogynistic attitudes and behavior, and engage in all kinds of self hatred and inner beatings, the men will never change or adapt.”

        Absolutely agree. I had many discussions about this topic and heard some people (well meaning people, mostly women) say that it’s men’s and patriarchy’s fault that some women internalized misogynistic values. Yes, true, but we can’t just stop there and be passive about it. It is patriarchy’s fault but it is up to women to break these chains.

  21. yes Elila this is perfectly it!

    “… i was in kind of in a cloud of despair i couldnt identify or articulate as a girl–but i think it was some sort of deep anxiety or resignation that what i saw around me was all there was and that was how i was going to end up, despite it feeling soooo off and just wrong somewhere in me. The women all considered a husband, no matter how wretched, the highest badge of honor and achievement & the only source of self worth. I didnt see a single woman who elected to be single or not have children…”

    yup! and yes it’s pretty annoying that you describe that stuff having grown up in the 70’s, but in the religious South it was STILL the same for me in the ’90’s lol. good gracious 🙄. and yes i struggle too with how much this stuff is still defended and played into by women. 😦 i try to have compassion for them as they only do what they’ve been taught, but i also get more and more defiant and hellbent that no matter how much they fight to keep themselves stuck in that old energy, they sure as goodness aren’t gonna pull me back into it with them.

    yes Maria so so interesting! especially to see how we’ve all had our own unique obstacles and variations of things to overcome, yet we’re all here so passionately seeking pathways to self-love. i guess self-love is a just defiantly persistent calling no matter how many ways the darkness tries to keep it quiet 💜💜💜

  22. “Kat lol, i think the Catholic way of just pretending there is no sex is still healthier than the conservative Christian way, which is mostly a big mess of shaming women for everything and anything about about sex, while doing everything possible to cater to men’s desires, and also doing everything possible to excuse their men for being totally dysfunctional perverts 🙄 .”

    It does sound more extreme what went on in the South, but my parents also shamed others for sex, and it was usually women. I remember my mum calling scantily clad women on TV pigs and that they should be ashamed. Whenever there was a couple about to kiss on tv they switched channels, because they felt awkward, if they stumbled upon a sex scene on tv (well not proper sex, but they simulate it) my father reacted angrily and full of disgust (mum,too). We were never allowed to have boyfriends .
    My dad never cheated on my mum though. I think if he did that I would have absolutely freaked out and if my mum stayed I would have lost all respect for her. Being horrible to live with AND get cheated on? That is just waaaayyyy too much.
    So I think growing up in such a hypocritical environment like you must have been really really hard and I bloody salute you for freeing yourself and breaking the chains. The same for you Elia, better late than never! You all rock my fellow free spirited women ❤

    " why is it “rebellion” that i don’t wish to get married or have kids? i just don’t want to lol. it’s not rebellion against anything at all :\ , it’s actually perfectly in line with how i naturally feel i’m meant to be. why is it “rebellion” that i’m independent – and always want to stay that way? being an independent being just makes sense and feels right to me."

    I don't consider it a rebellion, it's your way of life and just because it doesn't conform with societal expectations of what women should want, it is noone else's business but yours. It has always baffled me why people give so much shit (excuse expression) about what other people do with their lives.

    "it’s funny cause as much as i am free in sense about it, i still need to let go of other people’s judgments and limitations about it to truly be free."

    Just remember, that you can't control what people think about you anyway, so best not give a damn about it in the first place lol. And those who judge you (imagine we still live in a world where women who dont want kids get judged) are not worthy of your time and energy anyway.

    I have a cousin, 2 years younger than me, who only got married because "it was time" and "everyone else was doing it"and mostly because her parents have been pushing her to "finally get settled" so she took the first guy that was half interested in her, got pregnant (he said he didnt want kids) and is now .- not happily – married to him. She has always had the annoying habit to constantly ask about our (mine and my sisters') love lives and because we were single almost all our lives (my first bf is the current one who I've been with for 2 years and it's thank God a long distance relationship) she always kept asking "but why, how come you don't have anyone" and kept digging and digging.
    I replied "I'm happy the way it is. I'd rather be alone than stuck in a loveless relationship"(hint, hint) haha. I didn't care because it was clear all along that she was just frustrated with her own situation and at the same time jealous of me and my sisters for not jumping into relationships just to have someone, for being "brave enough" to be single and not give a shit.
    And I'm quite sure that the majority of people who judge women for wanting to be single and childless are that exact same time of person. They are jealous because they don't dare to break their chains. People who are truly happy with themselves wouldn't do that. 🙂

    • Kat, yup, my daddy did cheat my entire life, and my mama is STILL with him, yes it’s so hard for me to even grasp how someone could bear that. but tragically it’s just how all of the women in my family are. literally all of my uncles & grandaddys,etc, they all cheated, and all of the women are all still married to them. i think my mama and her sisters find comfort in that…since they all have had it happen to them, they just settle it as “well this is just what men do”, and then “it’s our job as women to stand by them”. ug it’s soooo awful. 😥

      and yeah i totally agree, women who can’t find it in them to break free resent those of us that do. i mentioned in another comment that i try to have compassion for them, but no ma’am, you’re not pulling me back into the dark with you. 😡

      • ” i mentioned in another comment that i try to have compassion for them, but no ma’am, you’re not pulling me back into the dark with you. 😡”

        Compassion sounds like effort lol. I can’t have that with peoplen who judge others for their lifestyles, because they feel stuck and unhappy themselves, anymore. Change something, and you’ll feel as good as us.
        I save my compassion for those women who suffer without judging women like us but rather see us as an inspiration

      • yeah i understand that. it’s easier for me to do from afar. i’m so reclusive these days that i hardly if never have to have face to face interaction with women like this, so i think i sorta mean all the women “out there” in the collective who are like this. and i think it’s maybe less of an active compassion, and more of “i don’t have any kinda energy in me to be actively resentful at you” lol. for instance there are a lot of women in the US right now who are fiercely fighting for patriarchal values, and fighting to take away my rights as a woman. it’s infuriating to me, but if i tune into how much i resent what they are doing, it exhausts my spirit. so i think i sort of just choose to have a passive “compassion” to where i see these women as asleep and unaware of just how much they sleep.

        when it’s face to face with people in your life like how you describe with your cousin, it’s much harder. i do tend to struggle quite a bit when interact with my sister-in-law who tries to push her religious views on me, but it takes way more energy to respond and engage, so i just try to not respond at all, and not let her energy invade mine.

        so i guess i could kinda speak it less as compassion, and more as “i’m way too tired to bother with y’all’s old energy nonsense” lol. 😛

  23. “but it takes way more energy to respond and engage, so i just try to not respond at all, and not let her energy invade mine.
    so i guess i could kinda speak it less as compassion, and more as “i’m way too tired to bother with y’all’s old energy nonsense” lol. 😛”

    Yeah that’s the best way to go I think. Just brush it off
    Oh and I’m very reclusive as well. I hardly communicate with anyone in real life and I love it 😀 😀

  24. Maria i too have noticed before how cool it is that we kinda have all the geratuons covered here! Love that. And kat i laughed when u said compassion sounds like effort–omg sooo true; i agree with sweet pea–im just too tired to look at or hear or engage with in any way y’alls old crusty energy! Aint nobody got time fo dat!!!
    And yep, another reclusive here–and i love it too!!! Theres no one id rather hang out with than the kick ass broad in the mirror LOL, and my wise beautiful pals here.
    💕😊💕

    • “And yep, another reclusive here–and i love it too!!! Theres no one id rather hang out with than the kick ass broad in the mirror LOL, and my wise beautiful pals here.
      💕😊💕”

      hahaha “the kick ass broad in the mirror” I f*ing love that. You are so funny 😀 😀

      I replied to one your answers up there if you haven’t see it
      January 27, 2017 at 10:35 pm

      Hugs 😀

    • That should say “GENERATIONS” up there, not “geratuons”
      Head. Slap. Lol

  25. Ah! Yes kat i did see that but then my brain got sidetracked somehow with the abundance of awesomeness being shared here heehee–your mother sure sounds a lot like my mother (who was not one of the “lucky” ones–she was cheated on AND beaten–and “loves” and defends him TO THIS DAY). Mine has said things like that to me my whole life, always rather haughtily indicating that i will surely end up just like her. But at this point its clearly nonsense and i sometimes even say to her “no. No i wont.” (She thinks im alone bcuz no man will HAVE me LOL). I agree with you–i would rather be alone my whole life (hey im in good company & well loved) than be with men like that, reinforcing that despicable behavior (which is sad for men too, not just women). I also agree that its more likely than not up to WOMEN to change first–i mean its WOMEN after all who are supporting, defending, sleeping with and reproducing with these men, and then GIVING BIRTH to and raising new men in that old paradigm thus reinforcing and perpetuating it further….
    I think if women as a whole simply started refusing to SHAG these abusive, misogynistic, violent, entitled, dishonest men, the world would change in a hot hurry LOL! Women have a pretty large role in CREATING the patriarchy (every jerk has a mother!) , and in continuing it by raising boys to be like their fathers (even inadvertantly just by having poor examples of manhood present & unchallenged). And these days i still see all around (and now its televised!) women actually fighting over these sad men, competing with each other to see who can give him the most and best sex–talk about positive reinforcement!! Why on earth would any man bother to question his own behavior let alone make changes when all around even the WORST ones (as far as i can see OJ is still getting laid!) have women vying for their attention & settling for crumbs of affection. I think women need to love themselves enough to find this entirely unacceptable before any real change will be seen, and my friend WE are the seeds of that, we are the examples of women who like themselves too much to endure inequality and disdain. Like sweet pea & i both said, it would have been helpful as a girl to see such a woman SOMEWHERE, and now there are more of us than ever before quietly being an example of another way for daughters and nieces and sisters and cousins and even mothers!

    • (And i think its good for the boys and young men in our circles to see us refusing to settle too…)

    • (Also mothers are not only raising their sons to perpetuate patriarchy, but teaching their daughters to abide it too)

    • And PS i am in no way saying patriarchy and inequality is all womens’ fault–only that we have a ROLE in it

    • good gracious Elila, aaaaa-men to this whole thread you just wrote! i’ve thought every single thing you just wrote here many times in my own head, and have wanted to shout it all from the mountain tops. i wish i could put all this here on every billboard on every highway from coast to coast 💜💜💜

      • Lol sweet pea im relieved to hear that–i was a leeeeetle bit apprehensive to post it bcuz i dont mean it to be inflamatory, only observational, but lots of people these days only want to argue small points out of context instead of saying to themselves “hmmm yes, when i put my hand on that stove it gets burned and painful every time….”
        Like why is it always so taboo to simply step back & look at a behavior and see that it is not producing a desired outcome, so perhaps do something different?
        I love your response!! 💜💕💜

      • especially this…

        “…its WOMEN after all who are supporting, defending, sleeping with and reproducing with these men, and then GIVING BIRTH to and raising new men in that old paradigm thus reinforcing and perpetuating it further…”

        i’ve felt this exact thing so so many times over and over, and for me this is the place where i found my own personal power with feminism. i’ve never felt like there is much of anyone getting anywhere by arguing with these men, trying to change these men, or in any other way engaging with lower masculine energy. all that does is give them the ability to try to make us the “enemy” and blame women for their behavior. if we just removed ourselves from the situation, misogynists and patriarchs would be left alone in a room with their misery and have no choice but to realize the anger and hatred they feel is within and at themselves.

        we’ve spent so much energy trying to get through to these kinds of men or “break through” to them… i say just stop. stop engaging them. stop trying to get through to them or go through them, and just go around them. learn to love ourselves without waiting for their approval or needing their permission to do so. and the kind of men we want and deserve, the kind of men who have been on their own journeys of learning to love themselves, will be waiting on the other side. 💜

    • Wow Elila. That was spot on in so many ways. You are so right. It is women, too who reinforce patriarchy – whether consciously or subconsciously – but it is changing with women like us who will not comply with all that crap anymore. I have nothing to add anymore, really. You just said it all.
      Thank you and hugs,
      Kat

  26. BRAVO sweet pea! That was so well stated. I completely agree–just go around them! And for the LOVE of god, stop shagging them!! Its like giving a dog treats for shitting on the rug for heavens sake. If no woman would bother to shag a trumpish male, well they would phase out pretty quickly! Just dont give them any attention. Save it for the self-loving men you spoke of–they are there! And i for one, if i were ever to consider a relationship again, would be looking for THAT in a man first and foremost!

  27. …and just to clarify that last little part a bit, even if there is no one waiting on the other side, do it for ourselves… just cause we deserve it for ourselves. (i just meant, women need only take care of their own journey, and trust that their are beautiful make souls taking care of their own journeys too 🙂 💜)

    • grr typos lol …

      ” trust that there are beautiful male souls”

    • YES!!! Yes yes yes. I agree 150% sweet pea. The man is not the point or the prize. Finding all that we need or want within us is the cake AND the icing! And the bonus is whatever we attract in that state will MATCH it. Misogyny will die in our experience because there will be no matching vibe–it will suffocate without our attention.

      • “YES!!! Yes yes yes. I agree 150% sweet pea. The man is not the point or the prize. Finding all that we need or want within us is the cake AND the icing! And the bonus is whatever we attract in that state will MATCH it. Misogyny will die in our experience because there will be no matching vibe–it will suffocate without our attention.”

        A-fuckin’ -MEN

        (ok that’s suggestive now, hahahahah, but you know what I mean)

      • yes! a-men to both of you and to all of this today! i feel like i could go climb a mountain right now lolzzzz 💜💜💜

  28. Lol kat –yep i knew what you meant! You gals are freakin awesome! I love this thread.
    And just to clarify to anyone else perhaps not quite in the self loving mode yet–i am NOT talking about withholding sex as a manipulative measure. Im talking about not rewarding misogyny in ANY way and opting out all together with men of that stripe–not merely using sex as a weapon to get him to go off script or coerce preferable behavior. Just leave those blokes alone & start treating your own sweet self the way you wish others would treat you for a start 💙 (Good chocolate and long fragrant baths dont hurt either 😉)

    • prolly because i am in self-loving mode, it never even crossed my mind for it to be taken that way 💜. i totally took it how you describe further in leaving that kind of man alone all together. i think in the kind of higher energy we are seeking, that wouldn’t even be a thing that a man would feel because i think a man who loved himself would never view sex as something he felt entitled to, or something he would view a woman as being manipulative for not “providing to him”. that’s how a misogynist might could see it, but back to your point… walk away from that guy!

      i would like to hope that the kind of man i would want to share my energy with would love himself enough to not want anything to do with me until i loved myself enough to know i deserved better 💜💜💜

      • Exaaaactly sweet pea! Once again i totally agree. But i am surrounded by a family and a town wholeheartedly supporting patriarchy and inequality, so i try to cover my bases LOL. In my environment im seen as out of touch with reality, idealistic and unrealistic. And they mistakenly assume im unaware of whats going on in the world bcuz i dont own a tv or endure “the news” haha. I get chided often as “sticking my head in the sand”, to which i reply “trust me. The world will never ALLOW you the LUXURY of not knowing.”
        Also i wanted to add that not only would self cherishing be something id want to see in a man before id consider romantic relationship, but also friends, male or female, becuz that is the kind of reality i want to strengthen with attention and energy in MY world! And its why i love sooo much being here among you all.
        💙💙💙

      • Oh and i also meant to say that i not only want to opt out with “men of that stripe” as i stated above, but i dont wish to engage really with the women who support misogyny either. Just walkin away from that playground game altogether 😉

      • yeah Elila i totally understand… having to tip toe these kinds of “crazy views” around people who live in old limitations 😥 . well your “crazy views” get nothin’ but a-mens from me haha 💜

  29. Thank you sweet pea–hugs to you brave fellow pioneer!!
    😊 💙💙💙

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